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Posts Made By: Joe Lentz

January 6, 2003 03:30 PM Forum: Religion

Re: Nothing interesting here

Posted By Joe Lentz

Well Ed, atheists vs. bible-thumpers may be boring, and deconstructing scripture can get old in a hurry, but people keep arguing about it anyway. The only reason atheists even have a label is because of the widespread persistance of religion. People seem to have the desire to name and define everything, so they even name the absence of things. I don't think atheists are trying to convert anyone, but merely to defend a rational alternative. Anyway, that bores you, so I'll try something else; we don't want anyone here to be bored!

OK Ed, what's your take on the infield fly rule?
Hmmm... maybe something easier. Let's see, aesthetics...

Many years ago I had a murex shell that was a perfect balance of shape, texture and color. To my mind it was whole and could not be improved on either by adding or taking away anything. It seemed to resonate with a sense of completeness, which isn't too shabby for an inanimate object. Well, I lost it and have no idea what happened to it. Maybe the experience of looking at that murex shell was too subjective to have any meaning outside of my own mind, but you could say that about lots of art, and lots of experiences too. Rilke said something about that, and I think it applies well to a few experiences I had in the 60s too. Anyway, on to the quote:

"My God, if any of it could be shared! But would it *be* then, would it *be*? No, it *is* only at the price of solitude."

- Rilke

Oh yeah, one other (unrelated) thing while I happen to think about it; this a bumper sticker I saw once:

"Jesus is coming! Look busy." I kinda liked it...


January 6, 2003 09:57 PM Forum: Religion

Two Quotes

Posted By Joe Lentz

Then he saw also that it matters little what profession, whether of religion or irreligion, a man may make, provided only he follows it out with charitable inconsistency, and without insisting on it to the bitter end. It is in the uncompromisingness with which dogma is held and not in the dogma or want of dogma that the danger lies.

- Samuel Butler

This is my simple religion. There is no need for temples; no need for complicated philosophy. Our own brain, our own heart is our temple; the philosophy is kindness.

- Dalai Lama

January 9, 2003 03:19 PM Forum: Religion

I have a sneaking suspicion...

Posted By Joe Lentz

...that I could come back to this forum a few months from now and the same arguments would still be taking place. The frustration for atheists (for lack of a better word) comes when their logic and reason is met with either incomprehension or denial. The frustration for the religious faction comes in when they perceive their faith being either mocked or rejected. In both cases I think there is a misunderstanding, as there are two different languages being used. I don't expect to see any kind of marriage between "science" and "religion" in the near future, which is as it should be. That isn't to say the people themselves can't get along. One of the hallmarks of a civilized society is the ability of people with different beliefs to coexist peacefully and productively. And guess what? That actually happens sometimes!

January 9, 2003 08:04 PM Forum: Religion

Re: A question for Herb, and a suggestion

Posted By Joe Lentz

I think I need to get my eyeglass prescription changed soon. The first time I read that it looked like "Astrophysics and Comedy". Not sure how that forum would shape up...

January 27, 2003 02:45 PM Forum: Religion

Burning question...

Posted By Joe Lentz

Don't any of you have to work for a living? ;-)

February 3, 2003 02:41 PM Forum: Religion

Re: This forum

Posted By Joe Lentz

Yes, I've noticed that Bill. Funny thing, after reading so many interesting and thought provoking posts, I still have essentially the same beliefs I've always had. Well, I guess that's no surprise really. My experience tells me that people generally believe what they want to believe... Still, there is occasional food for thought in this forum, and the opportunity to learn something new... plus there is the entertainment value. :-)

March 6, 2003 08:12 PM Forum: Religion

...and Politics

Posted By Joe Lentz

First time I've noticed that addition, but then I haven't been here in awhile. Seems appropriate to throw that in with religion and philosophy though. I watched the press conference tonight. Was it my imagination or did Bush use the same answer for every question? Strange times we live in to be sure..

March 16, 2003 07:52 PM Forum: Religion

Re: Our Vice President

Posted By Joe Lentz

Don't forget Donald Rumsfeld...

March 21, 2003 06:49 PM Forum: Off Topic Discussions

Re: Common ground

Posted By Joe Lentz

Michael, for what it's worth, I agree with the spirit of your original post, particularly about the need for civility. I too support our troops. That doesn't mean I agree with, or (sadly) have very much faith in the people who sent them over there. These are very disturbing times, and I am afraid that this action not only misses those who SHOULD be held accountable for 9-11, but will also create even more instability in the world. For those who disagree with me, fine... that is your right, just as it is mine to disagree with you. Just remember; our government has made mistakes before, and blind obedience is not patriotism. It is the business of each citizen to exercise his or her own conscience and use his or her own critical thinking skills, especially in times like these... after all, it is we who are really the final branch of the government... or are supposed to be. Only time will tell if this action was the best way to handle Saddam. We won't know at any time in the near future, regardless of how well this blitzkrieg works in the short term. For now, god bless our troops... and god bless the Iraqi civilians too.

April 23, 2003 07:08 PM Forum: Religion

You guys still...

Posted By Joe Lentz

...haven't caught up with Off Topic Discussions yet. I don't think you're trying hard enough. ;-)