Posts Made By: Jim Moscheck

Originally Posted by Richard Davis

Let me make something very clear to you.  We on the right DON'T condone what occurred.  We don't condone it at all.

Originally Posted by Rod Kaufman

"A growing list of companies are cutting off donations to politicians who opposed the Electoral College results, targeting the 147 Republican members of the House and the Senate who voted against affirming President-elect Joe Biden’s victory."
https://thehill.com/business-a-lobbying/533795-here-are-the-companies-suspending-political-contributions-following-the

Originally Posted by Greg Shaffer

As far as I am concerned the election WAS stolen.....something like 8 states ignored their own election laws in one way or another and just did whatever they wanted to yet had their votes counted. Extending registration dates, voting end dates etc by simple declaration instead of via legislation. That in and of itself delegitimizes the election. Those actions are a matter of record......While there are other questionable and obvious issues as well that can be argued ignored election laws are enough without anything else.....

Originally Posted by James Brown

Hi Jim:

I'm sympathetic to the GOP leaders, and of course I'm in the same boat since I voted for Trump in '96 and tried to support him throughout.  I think the CNN montage bears some discussion.  Sorry, but this will bit a bit long.  

The psychic sound bites were taken from the campaign trail - of course his opponents were warning against Trump - they wanted the nomination.  A lot of us wanted a different candidate.  I actually became a delegate to support Rubio in the local convention.  We lost.  So what do we Rs do then?

Option 1 would be to quit the party, at least nominally, and oppose Trump because one truly believed that he was dangerous.  This is the route Russ took, I hope I am not overstating Russ's position (pretty sure I am understating it actually!).  Good for him, his position proved to be wise in retrospect, especially since the pandemic started and through the election aftermath.

Option 2 for any R is to do the best you can to support the elected leader of your party.  This is the position me, Rubio, Cruz, Haley and many others took.  I don't think this option turned out too bad until the election of 2020 and aftermath.  We can disagree about whether the country was F'd up before the pandemic or whether the pandemic was significantly worsened by the Federal response.  Heck, we can disagree about whether the country is F'd up now.  Biden takes office in a week and a half.  We can agree to be happy about that.  A lot happened in the economy and world affairs in 2017-2019 that can please a traditional R.

Option 3 of course is to support Trump to the death and metaphorically (or literally) storm the capital.   That is not such a good option for Rubio, Cruz, Haley and the like.  I think they are really in the "Option 2" group along with me.

I don't think the "Option 2" R leadership is guilty of hypocrisy or toadyism for supporting Trump up to the election.  They/we made the best of a bad situation.  Arguably the country would have been in a much worse place if the Rs had entirely abandoned Trump in 2017.  Arguably the country would be in a much worse place under HRC.  So, my beef with this CNN montage is the underlying messaging - that those Rs who supported Trump until the wheels came off are hypocrites who knew better.  I don't see it that way, and I certainly did not anticipate Trump's behavior after the election.  FWIW I think that Trump's drumbeat of "Stolen Election" is doing far more damage to the national fabric than the riot.  The riot is a predictable effect of Trump's bogus assault on the various states elections. 

Maybe Rubio, Cruz, Haley and so on will pay the ultimate price and maybe this will be an extinction event for the Rs who supported Trump in any way whatsoever.  That is obviously CNN's goal.  I doubt this is the end though.  Come 2022 and 2024, I think you'll see the GOP doing pretty well.

Jim

Originally Posted by Rod Kaufman

"President Trump told Vice President Pence he had a choice between being remembered by history “as a patriot … or as a p----” while attempting to pressure him to overturn the results of the presidential election, according to a report from The New York Times."
"He set Mike Pence up that day by putting it on his shoulders,” Ryan Streeter, who served an adviser to Pence when he was governor of Indiana, told the Times. “That’s a pretty unprecedented thing in American politics. For a president to throw his own vice president under the bus like that and to encourage his supporters to take him on is something just unconscionable in my mind.”
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/533961-trump-told-pence-he-could-be-a-patriot-or-p-y-when-overseeing

Originally Posted by James Brown

Russ;

Your comments, James' comments and Brian's comments are affecting the way I am thinking about this incident and the larger implications.  I do appreciate your collective insight.

Jim