Posts Made By: Les Chambers

Terry, you cover a lot of ground and for the sake of brevity, I'll just offer a couple observations.

First, I'm heartened that we share common ground on a couple issues. That's good. Now, where we disagree. You, the right, the priviledged class ect. constantly fault the left for taxation. The U.S. has one of the lowest rate of taxation in the 1st or 2nd world. And it shows, the U.S. lags behind Europe in just about every measure of societal health from universal health care, leisure time and retirement benefits. Europe has a higher college graduation rates and longer life spans. The lower taxed US has a falling life spans, and crumbling infrastructure ranging from highway bridges to city water and sewer systems. With taxes, like everything else, you get what you pay for.

Iran and Korea. Didn't you notice that the progress you mention came only AFTER the Bush administration softened its neocon approach and tried diplomacy? If GW and Dick C. had listened to Collin Powell and Condolesa Rice in 2002 and 2004 both situations may have been avoided completely. As for Georgia/Russia. That dance ain't over yet and if you get your news from anywhere but FOX you may have heard that Putin claims that it was the US that instigated the Georgians to help McCain's election chances. BS you say? The EU believed enough of it to abandon sanctions against Russia.


Safety net/Universal health care. Why can't we afford it? We "afford" $10B a month in Iraq. Its not a question of "affording" but of priorities. Countries throughout Europe that have a fraction of the GNP the US does, manage to provide at least some level of health care for all their citizens.
If Portugal or Greece can provide health coverage, why not US?

wars that costs 100,000 lives and counting,

Wars are not the exclusive province of the right. Don't forget that it was a pair of Democratic presidents that got us into Vietnam, ****

You are right to an extent. Neither party owns wars. And the "major" wars of the 20th century did take place on democratic watches. But, what about all the "forgotten" wars? The US incursion into the Russian Revolution, 1918-1922. (Wilson D, Harding R), Nicaragua "intervention" 1909-1833. Teddy R. (R), Taft (R), Wilson, Harding,(R) Coolridge (R) , Hoover (R).

Rather than bore you with details of US involvments everywhere from the Phillipines to Iran and even China, check out this site:http://academic.evergreen.edu/g/grossmaz/interventions.html

Crosschecking the 125 times the US has used military force from 1900 to 2007, you will observe that the vast majority of the interventions took place under the watch of republican presidents. In fact, WWI and WWII are noteworthy b/c they took place under Democrats. Blood baths like Nicaragua, Phillipines,Korea, and Viet Nam were all brought to you by the GOP and its big business masters, be they sugar growers, rubber companies or, dare we say it? Oil?

continued subjugation to the oil barons

What risks do the oil companies take? They didn't create the oil or put it in the ground. The oil was located by U.S. Geologic surveys/ They simply by a right to extract it and then sell it to a captive market at a profit of Billions of dollars a QUARTER! Oh poor, poor Exxon.

QUOTE:
We're sending massive amounts of money overseas to buy oil from other countries, and the liberal left can't even spot the fact that a bunch of that money could STAY HOME if we drilled our *own* oil; they keep making specious excuses for NOT doing so. THAT form of "subjugation" somehow doesn't seem so bad to them.

Thats BS but that horse has already been beaten to glue. Wreck the environment to extract the last drop of oil and it might last US 10 years. What then? In the meantime, we've continued to borrow trillions of dollars from China to pay for oil from Shieks in the Middle East who use the money to fund our demise.

... and record levels of national debt.

Again we agree. But Bill Clinton cleared the national debt and left office with a surplus of billions of dollars. It was the "fiscally conservative" Republicans who dug the hole we're in now.


Les

Consider the news just since the end of the Republican convention: 1. record federal deficit; 2. highest unemployment rate in recent memory; 3. downward revision of 1st and 2nd quarter GDP figures; 4. Taxpayer bailout of FannieMae/FreddieMac 5. Collapse of Leymann Bros.; 6. Distress sale of Merrill Lynch; 7. Govt. purchase of AIG; 8. Govt."rescue plan" of bank assets costing per Treasury Secret. Paulson "100s of Billions". Did I forget anything? There is this: 2 days ago NPR asked Business Week Bureau Chief why the feds bailed out FannieMae/FreddieMac but let Lehman Bros go to the wall. His answer: The Chinese govt owned billions of dollars of FannieMae/FreddieMac stock/assets. If the U.S. let the Chinese lose that money, the P.R.C. may not be inclined to keep purchasing U.S. Treasury bills. That, my friend, speaks loudest of all.

I'm amazed that the responses of this poll are running overwelmingly against govt. involvment. Similarly, McC and Sarah are surviving only by raising a spectre of "big govt".

Today we had another 500 point drop in the DOW, if you're counting that is just about 2000 point since this time last month. Also, today the Congressional Budget Office reported to Congress that since last year, US pension funds have lost $2 Trillion. In politics, that's whats called a "Trial ballon", signal that the SBO thinks yet another bailout is on the way. These staggering losses are due in large measure because of a lack of govt involvment. Since Reagan the US has been on a deregulation binge. We've dereg'ed everything from trucking and airlines to the banking industry. As a result, the only two emotions of capitalism, greed and fear, have run amok. Collectively we have lost trillions of dollars. If you really want to scare the pi$$ out of yourself google "credit default swaps". But to look on the brightside, once the economy grinds to a halt, light pollution may actually diminish and we won't need to drive 90 minutes to observe. ;-)

George Edwards said:

Yes the "My Friends" thing is creepy, but the scariest thing about the debate was that John McCain looked like a walking cadaver and needed to take a nap for about the next four years . If McCain manages to win I doubt he will be physically able to do the job , that would mean we would have Sarah Palin and her band of religious extremists running the country , now that truly would be scary.

What makes McC's health troublesome is that 9 of the 43 US presidents have come to power from the vice-presidency because of the death or removal of the elected president. 5 20th century presidents succeeded to that office as VPs. Moreover, several other presidents were mentally unfit to serve during part of their term. Wilson comes to mind. Even IF McC was healthy and much younger that still gives Palin a better than 1 in 4 chance of becoming the 45th president. Actuarily, a HEALTHY 72 year old man has a 3 in 10 chance of dying within 4 years. That same man has a 7 out of 10 chance of expiring within the next 8 years. That is for an otherwise healthy person. McC already has had several bouts of cancer and his physicians and campaign are being pretty tight lipped about the nature of the cancer they cut out of his cheek (No Jeff that lump is not a gum ball). What all this means is that electing J.McC is almost certainly a vote to put Palin, with all of her faith healing, creationist credentials in the Oval Office. "Mr. Maverick" couldn't even stand up to the far right in his own party and name the VP he wanted, i.e. Lieberman. Instead, his decision to put Palin on his ticket was the most irresponsible thing he has ever done. So much for putting "Country First"

Les

[QUOTE]Jeffrey Counsil said:

Where do you get "religious extremists" from??? *** Oh, btw, that preacher that Sarah Palin was getting (peaceful) prayer from is from Kenya.. Ring any bells?

Check out this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG1vPYbRB7k Apparently Sarah believes in all that "end-time" crap and that the role of her church is to make Alaska "holy" enough to serve as a refuge for the sufficiently devout who will flee there from the lower 48 during the years of tribulation. Add to this the point that the idiot is also a creationist (I know idiot and creationist are redundant), who thinks that men and dinosaurs co-existed and it is clear that the religious extremist title fits her quite well.

[QUOTE]Steven Moore said:

I can not get the Reverend Wright preaching his hate out of my mind as far as Obama goes. I can not understand what is wrong with the Democratic party that in this election they should of had no trouble at all electing their person for president.
Regards,Steve

White Americans do have a tough time grasping the fact that the rest of the world, particularly the non-white part, does not always see its actions as beneficial, altruistic or fair. As for Wrights' "chickens coming home to roost' sermon, which I believe you are referring to, he is factually correct. 9-11 happened inter alia, because the United States supports Israel. Everytime Israel shells a village, shoots a rock throwing kid, or strafes a refugee camp the money and weapons do so comes directly from Uncle Sam. Also, we allow despotic regimes like the Saudi royal family to stay in power and treat their nation's oil wealth as their personal property, while their population lives in 3rd world conditions. In Iran, we killed a popularly elected prime minister because he was a socialist and installed and propped up the Shah for 25 years. In just the 20th century the U.S. used military force to protect is business or other interests over 200 times. As a result, good chunks of the world population hate the U.S. It was (is) only a matter of time before that hatred came back to hit us.

Les

Jeffrey Counsil said:

John McCain is an American Hero. He served this country and put his life on the line. YOU should at least RESPECT the man by spelling his name correctly. He is a Veteran of War. He was a P.O.W. that was Tortured and survived! He is a true Patriot! I don't always agree with him, but I give him the respect he deserves.

I'll leave your anti-socialism rant speak for itself. As for respecting McC, I USED to respect John McCain alot. In 2000 I supported him for the nomination and I still believe that had he won in 2000 the world and our country would be better off. However, the last 3 weeks he has shredded any claim to respect. Even George Will came out against him this past week. Since the economic collapse began McC has proven to be erratic and unbalanced. More important, his campaign rallies the last 2 weeks have turned too ugly for comfort. They remind me, if not of Nuremburg, the anti-integration mobs of the 1950s and anti-busing demonstrations of the 1970s. Substitute Sarah Palin for George Wallace and "liberal media/terrorists" for "uppity n*ggers, college radicals and yankee politicians" and the fit is depressingly close. I realize you weren't born when it was decided to integrate innercity schools by busing white kids across town to mostly black schools. However, the masses of white christian, "love-thy-neighbor" hockey moms and dads who turned out to stone buses, spit at kids and set fire barracades showed a side of America most people chose to ignore. It is this type of raw, visceral hatred that Palin and McC are trading in to win this election. McC made a faustian bargain with the far right extremists and religious nuts. Having done so he has forfeited any claim to "respect." (As for his status as a veteran. Nice, but hardly relevant. Adolf Hitler was a veteran for that matter. Tell me why that should matter as our 401s evaporate?)

Les

[QUOTE]Richard Wright said:

I think the lack of optimisim comes from finding the financial sector has become a den of con men and criminals rather than the responsible agents of progress acting in enlightened self-interest we had thought were in those positions. Daily shifts in the stock market are worth more than the stimulous package it takes the government months to move on. The government is equipped to keep us from starving; not to setting up a sudden golden age out if disaster.

To which I reply: I agree that most of the problems come from Wall Street, but lets face it: the core of the problem is the American people and their tendency to live far beyond their means. People bought houses that didn't deserve to own houses because either they couldn't afford them and/or they had a poor history of paying existing debts already. Same thing with consumer goods, everything from $40K SUVs and wall-sized HDTVs. If it was new and trendy, Americans thought they had a god given right to own it, irrespective of their actual ability to pay for it. Yes, Wall Street and bankers are to blame in part, but they only lent to people who were more than willing to borrow.

Les

Doug Bailey said:

Absolutely right. But I bet you get blasted for saying it. A lib thinks anything is okay as long as it isn't about God, guns, or the Constitution.
Doug

Funny you mention guns. I suppose you're against any type of gun control? "Guns good. Drugs bad, Right?" I wonder tho, would those 10 folks that died tonight in Alabama still prefer that Cannabis be banned and assault rifles be legal?

Les

I'm speculating but the image could represent an argument in favor of decriminalization. Assume the first image is a college age girl who gets busted for a token amount of coke. What happens? She is a felon. This makes her ineligible for student loans, so she probably won't finish school. Even if she does, the felony conviction means that she is barred from just any job that requires a state license-nursing, teaching, truck driving, cosmetologist. In fact, with a felony conviction, she is unemployable in many sectors that don't require licensing. So naturally she looks a little worse for the wear as the pictures move on. Your drug laws, with their irrational penalties, does nothing but fund organized crime and marginalize ordinarily decent people. Add to this the astronomical Dollar costs of fighting the "drug war". This is why such "liberals" as William Buckley and George Will favor decriminalizing drugs.