Posts Made By: Chris Pagan

Originally Posted by James Lacey

I'll tell you what, Rich. If what Musk did is so typical and agreeable, why don't you, Chris, and the rest of MAGA adopt it as your new way of expressing gratitude? Every time you want to thank a customer, simply slap your chest with your palm and then extend a straight-arm salute. Even add in the phrase, "I give my heart to you," if you like. Use it with friends, family, clients, basically anyone you want to extend gratitude towards. But you won't, because you know that if you did, they would interpret it as a N@z! salute and you would lose clients. I would say you would lose friends and family, but I doubt you have any left to lose based on your behavior in this forum.

Originally Posted by Rod Kaufman

"If Rubio had any self-respect, he'd resign.  Talk about finding yourself on the wrong side of history"

How true, and, looking at the response from the leaders of European nations, we see:

"Germany's foreign minister Annalena Baerbock said the "unspeakable" row resembled a "bad dream" and "underlined that a new age of infamy has begun".

"French President Emmanuel Macron posted: "There is an aggressor: Russia. There is a victim: Ukraine. We were right to help Ukraine and sanction Russia three years ago - and to keep doing so."

"Dutch Prime Minister Dick Schoof said the Netherlands supports Ukraine "now more than ever", adding: "We want a lasting peace and an end to the war of aggression started by Russia. For Ukraine and its people, and for Europe."

"Spanish Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez said: "Ukraine, Spain stands with you," while his Polish counterpart Donald Tusk wrote: "Dear [Zelensky], dear Ukrainian friends, you are not alone."

"There were also supportive messages for Ukraine from political leaders in Austria, Belgium, Croatia, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, Ireland, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Moldova, Romania, Sweden and Slovenia."

"Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said Canada "will continue to stand with Ukraine and Ukrainians in achieving a just and lasting peace".

"Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese posted that his country had "proudly supported the brave people of Ukraine in their struggle to defend their sovereignty against the brutality of Russian aggression and in support of international law".

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cz9n5jq42pdo

It seems many of the sane leaders of the world have spoken...

Originally Posted by Rod Kaufman

First, in aid provided to Ukraine, as per the BBC it needs to be understood that Trump's claim of $350 billion is false and maximally it's about $182 billion and probably closer to $119 billion but either way, it's substantially less than what Trump claims. 

"We asked the White House about the basis for the $350bn claim. So far, it hasn't provided an explanation."


"President Trump has claimed: "We've spent more than $300bn and Europe has spent about $100bn - that's a big difference"

"Short answer: Figures suggest Europe has spent more when all aid is included and, as above, we can't find any evidence for the $300bn figure."

"The United States is, by some margin, the largest single donor to Ukraine. But Europe combined has spent more money than the United States, according to the Kiel Institute.

"The figure includes aid directly from the European Union, but also from bilateral deals from European countries, both inside and outside the EU. It includes military, financial and humanitarian aid."

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/crew8y7pwd5o

That said, what you're supposedly doing is thinking the war can be "negotiated" with Putin.

"Since the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russian troops have repeatedly occupied swathes of territory in former Soviet republics – and despite years of negotiations overseen by European powers, they still haven’t left."

"In Moldova, Russian forces are still stationed in the breakaway region of Transnistria, which declared its – largely unrecognised – independence as the USSR fell in ruins around it. And a full fifth of Georgia’s territory is still occupied by Russian troops who routed Tbilisi's forces following the Georgian government’s efforts to violently suppress secessionist movements in Abkhazia and South Ossetia."

"Russia always tries to reach an agreement which it necessarily breaks. It's a pattern, it breaks the promises that it makes because it knows that nobody is going to enforce the agreements, nobody is going to hold Russia accountable for breaking its promises and agreements."

"And this is the pattern that we are observing now with Ukraine – what Russia is trying to do at the moment is exactly the same thing as it did with Moldova and Georgia. And there is another pattern – every American administration, probably with the exception of Biden's presidency, has these illusions that it can make a lasting peace with Russia. It failed every time."

https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20250219-why-europe-leadership-skeptical-negotiating-putin-ukraine-war-trump

You can read about what followed in the Minsk agreements between Russia and Ukraine in the above link but it's obvious Putin broke those, too.