Posts Made By: Rod Kaufman

Glad to see the vast majority of Republicans and Democrats disagree with Rich:
https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/575835-poll-74-percent-say-covid19-related-restrictions-are-effective

Originally Posted by James Brown

Rich, consider a cost/benefit analysis for the vaccines.  Benefits are easy, lives saved, social restrictions dropped, economy re-opened.  The benefits are in my opinion almost incalculably huge.  The costs are some bad reactions in some cases.  I think the benefits vastly outweigh the costs for society as a whole.  What do you think?

p.s.  Lest you go off on a tangent, I fully support the right of folks like Greg to choose not to get vaccinated.  I'm talking about costs and benefits on a society wide scale.  

Jim

"I fully support the right of folks like Greg to choose not to get vaccinated."
I don't agree with you anymore than I agree with Greg. I don't think they have the right to spread covid anymore than they do to spread polio or smallpox or any other deadly infectious disease they were vaccinated against when they were younger.  By your way of thinking, I don't think they have the right to hospital care for covid, either.
Here's today's WH response to the likes of DeSantis and Abbott:
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/576399-white-house-rebukes-abbott-desantis-for-efforts-to-resist-vaccine

Originally Posted by Richard Davis

He's not spreading anything. He has greater antibody protection than you do, since he has natural immunity and we now know that those who are vaccinated can get Covid and spread it as well.  

That is a fact, so you don't know what you are talking about.  The best way not to spread the illness is if one is dead.

If you're afraid of spreading the illness or getting the illness, go jump off a tall building.  I doubt anyone would stand in your way.  

"The data is clear: Natural immunity is not better. The COVID-19 vaccines create more effective and longer-lasting immunity than natural immunity from infection."
"More than a third of COVID-19 infections result in zero protective antibodies
"Natural immunity fades faster than vaccine immunity"
"Natural immunity alone is less than half as effective than natural immunity plus vaccination
The takeaway: Get vaccinated, even if you've had COVID-19. Vaccine immunity is stronger than natural immunity."
"Natural immunity can be spotty. Some people can react vigorously and get a great antibody response. Other people don't get such a great response," says infectious diseases expert Mark Rupp, MD. "Clearly, vaccine-induced immunity is more standardized and can be longer-lasting."
https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/covid-19-studies-natural-immunity-versus-vaccination

Originally Posted by Richard Davis

And everything you just said above is bullshit:

https://headlineusa.com/harvard-natural-immunity-27-vax/

Harvard Epidemiologist Martin Kulldorff said this:

“Prior COVID disease (many working class) provides better immunity than vaccines (many professionals), so vaccine mandates are not only scientific nonsense, they are also discriminatory and unethical,” Kulldorff wrote Twitter, according to Red Voice Media.

And:

However, it comes as questions begin to grow about the lack of available autopsies for US fatalities diagnosed with COVID-19, and a British study showed that for those 50 and older, 68% of those admitted to the hospital with serious COVID symptoms had received two vaccine jabs.

"In early October, Kulldorff — an epidemiologist at Harvard Medical School — and two scientists, Stanford professor Jay Bhattacharya and Oxford epidemiologist Sunetra Gupta, met in Great Barrington, Mass., at the headquarters of the American Institute of Economic Research, a libertarian think tank funded by fossil fuel companies and the Koch brothers. Kulldorf had noticed Bhattacharya and Gupta in the news. They were both part of a minority of scientists vocal about their frustrations with the growing consensus around “flattening the curve.”
"Kulldorff, Bhattacharya, and Gupta signed the memorandum while unmasked, and toasted it with champagne. According to its website, it has received 600,000 signatures from concerned citizens and scientists, though the group acknowledges some are fake."
"To Lynn R. Goldman, the dean of public health at George Washington University, the publication of the Great Barrington Declaration was irresponsible. “It takes hubris to write anything like the Great Barrington Declaration,” she says, “because it is such a departure from anything that the science is supporting.”
Goldman, along with a team of over 30 epidemiologists, published an opposing letter, titled the John Snow Memorandum, in The Lancet, a prominent medical journal. It condemns the approach described in the Great Barrington Declaration as “a dangerous fallacy unsupported by scientific evidence.” So far, over 4,000 other scientists have signed it.'
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2020/10/29/great-barrington/

Originally Posted by Greg Shaffer

The fact that there are so many contradictive studies and opinions boils down to one thing.....We dont KNOW yet and only time will tell. 

We do know. Again:

"The data is clear: Natural immunity is not better. The COVID-19 vaccines create more effective and longer-lasting immunity than natural immunity from infection."
"More than a third of COVID-19 infections result in zero protective antibodies
"Natural immunity fades faster than vaccine immunity"
"Natural immunity alone is less than half as effective than natural immunity plus vaccination
The takeaway: Get vaccinated, even if you've had COVID-19. Vaccine immunity is stronger than natural immunity."
"Natural immunity can be spotty. Some people can react vigorously and get a great antibody response. Other people don't get such a great response," says infectious diseases expert Mark Rupp, MD. "Clearly, vaccine-induced immunity is more standardized and can be longer-lasting."
https://www.nebraskamed.com/COVID/covid-19-studies-natural-immunity-versus-vaccination

"In today’s MMWR, a study of COVID-19 infections in Kentucky among people who were previously infected with SAR-CoV-2 shows that unvaccinated individuals are more than twice as likely to be reinfected with COVID-19 than those who were fully vaccinated after initially contracting the virus. These data further indicate that COVID-19 vaccines offer better protection than natural immunity alone and that vaccines, even after prior infection, help prevent reinfections."
“If you have had COVID-19 before, please still get vaccinated,” said CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky. “This study shows you are twice as likely to get infected again if you are unvaccinated. Getting the vaccine is the best way to protect yourself and others around you, especially as the more contagious Delta variant spreads around the country.”
"The study of hundreds of Kentucky residents with previous infections through June 2021 found that those who were unvaccinated had 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with those who were fully vaccinated.  The findings suggest that among people who have had COVID-19 previously, getting fully vaccinated provides additional protection against reinfection."
https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2021/s0806-vaccination-protection.html

“Many of the questions about natural immunity are people who were just skeptical of the vaccine in the first place.,” Alabama State Health Officer Dr. Scott Harris told reporters last week. “And I wish that wasn’t the case. If you've been infected naturally, then the very best chance you have to protect yourself is to get vaccinated on top of that.”
"Harris said it is especially risky to rely on natural immunity if someone has not had the disease. Even if a person has, he said, that is no guarantee, either.
“We have had thousands of people in Alabama who’ve been infected at least twice and some of them three times or more – or even more,” he said. “And you know, the mortality rate for those people is a little bit better the second time around or the third time around but it’s not great.”
"Regardless of whether natural immunity or vaccine immunity is superior, Harris said, there is no data to show that getting vaccinated after an infection causes any harm."
"Harris cited a study of his own – a Centers for Disease Control and Prevention examination of Kentucky residents who had been infected last year. Of that group, those who were unvaccinated were 2.3 twice as likely to contract COVID-19 than those who were fully vaccinated."
https://www.fox10tv.com/news/coronavirus/natural-immunity-vs-vaccine-induced-immunity/article_554a0694-1b4e-11ec-9fe2-2bbc324c063c.html

Originally Posted by Greg Shaffer

I have noticed one consistent thing with Rod..... When he finds something that agrees with his perspective, it becomes the gospel for him to the exclusion of all else. Given all the conflicting reports I am good with we dont know yet as well.....

Well, GREG, if you're so confident in your natural immunity against covid and won't take the vaccine because of it, then why don't you march yourself down to your doctor's office or "ask your doctor" where you can get the antibody titer test for it? See if they still can  find one antibody left over from your covid infection. Thanks to your democratic supplied health care insurance, Medicare, you won't have to pay for it, either. How about it, GREG?

Originally Posted by Richard Davis

Why should he?  Whose business is it?  Certainly not yours, and the ignorance that you display on a minute by minute basis here is unbelievable.

It does however give us insight into your buffoonish mindset.  

He won't have to pay for the test because he's on Medicare? 

So he and the rest of the nation DO NOT PAY for Medicare, both directly AND indirectly??  

I don't think Greg is destitute, so he'll most likely have to pay for coverage, both Directly and Indirectly.  

The ignorance on display here is yours. If Greg won't get vaccinated, he's at risk of getting sick again, possibly seriously and winding up in the hospital(at considerable expense, again covered by medicare) and he risks affecting the public as well. 
If Greg thinks he's got natural immunity, let's see if they can even find any evidence of it with an antibody titer test. 

Originally Posted by Richard Davis

If Greg is vaccinated he's at risk of getting sick again, dipshit.  

And if he was vaccinated he risks affecting the public as well, dipshit.

Talk about ignorance...

Originally Posted by Greg Shaffer

Guess you skipped over the post where I said I have gotten tested regularly since my recovery (approx every 3 months) and the last time was about a month ago.....I still have active antibodies and a fairly good load at that.....not as much as the 1st time but still plenty per my doctor. As I stated previously I plan to continue regular testing and when the time comes I dont have a good load of active antibodies, that will be when I consider taking the jab and not before. Note I said CONSIDER, it will depend on the information available when the time comes. 

In fact here is the plan discussed with my Doc.....

Should I feel like I might be catching it again then I will get the viral test. If it comes back positive we are going to do the HCQ, Ivermectin, Zinc etc regimen immediately. My Doc has had good success with that early on ie no one he has treated has been hospitalized (NO ONE) with the exception of TWO who came to him after they were deep into it, both of them died but they were both also 70+ and had some contributing conditions. This out of several hundred. 

Hopefully I will not catch it again.....although in my case the 1st time was not as bad as a couple bouts I have had with the flu in my lifetime. I slowed me down for a couple weeks but that was it. 

"If it comes back positive we are going to do the HCQ, Ivermectin, Zinc etc"
oakie doakie...